Full transcript: Nitin Gadkari's exclusive interview at Green Bharat Summit

Gadkari also shared key initiatives aimed at reducing pollution and promoting alternative fuels.

At the Green Bharat Summit hosted by Network 18, Nitin Gadkari, India's Minister of Road Transport and Highways, engaged in an insightful conversation with Nalin Mehta, Managing Editor of Moneycontrol. They discussed the government's vision for sustainable growth, highlighting ambitious targets for electric vehicles (EVs) and green mobility.

Here's the full transcript: 

Nalin Mehta: Thanks very much. Gadkari Ji, it's a real pleasure to have you here with us on Network 18 for the Green Bharat Summit. Sir, under your leadership, we have seen a huge expansion of our national highways in the last 10 years, about 60% in length, 2.6x in width, but Green Bharat and Green Mobility has been very central to your vision as well. So in EVs in particular, there are some very ambitious targets that you have. By 2030, 30% of passenger vehicles to be EVs, commercial vehicles 70%, buses 40%, two and three wheelers 80%, but today we are at about 2% to 3%. So how do you get there from now over the next six years?

Nitin Gadkari: Frankly speaking, you don't think about the targets, because it is beyond our imagination the way in which the EV industry's number is increased. It is really amazing. The most important thing is the cost. Now in our country, we have the import of the fossil fuel costing 22 lakh crores. And now as compared with petrol and diesel, now suppose you are using 120 rupees of petrol in the car or a scooter, then for electricity, it needs only 10 to 12 rupees. For CNG, it will need 50 rupees. So it is import substitute, cost effective, pollution free and indigenous. Now the problem is the cost of the EV was the problem. Because when we start this project, particularly when we start talking about EV, the cost of the lithium ion battery was $150 per kilowatt per hour. Now in India, it is up to $100 per kilowatt per hour. And now one of the cell manufacturers was telling me that it comes to 80 rupees, $80 per kilowatt per hour. It means that it will be the same like petrol and diesel.

And if you have a petrol car, you are spending 30,000 rupees per month. For electric, you have to spend only 3 to 4,000. So naturally, there's a very, very reasonably good saving, no pollution, import substitute, cost effective, pollution free, and even our models are good. Yeah, I don't want to take the name of the company, but our models are equivalent to Tesla. Even some of the models, I feel that they prove to be more than Tesla. And rates are very cheaper. So sky is the limit. Huge potential is there. No matter how much you increase the strength and capacity of our EV (electric vehicle) systems, the demand cannot be fully met—it's like the sea.

Nalin Mehta: You’ve talked about Tesla. Are we in conversation with Tesla for investments in India?

Nitin Gadkari: Sir, I'm not talking about them. Only I'm telling you, now you just understand the world scenario. When I took charge as a minister, the size of the industry was $7 lakh crore. Now presently, the size of the industry is $22 lakh crore. And we have just surplused Japan. And our number is now third. So the first number is USA. The size of the industry is $78 lakh crore. Second is China. It is $47 lakh crore. And India, it is $22 lakh crore. And I'm confident, and my previous track record is so perfect, that whatever I'm going to tell to the people, 100% that is going to happen. In five years, we will be number one in the world. And e-vehicle will be the main reason for increasing the size of industry. And there is domestic market and export market.

Now all two-wheeler, Bajaj, TVS, Honda, Hero, they have 50% of their production is export. And now in EV, the domestic demand will be increased at the same time export demand will be increased because of the quality of the product, because of the design of the product, and because of the cost of the product. Sky is the limit and I'm confident that this industry is going to 100% fulfil the dream of our Prime Minister to make India Aatmanirbhar Bharat.

Nalin Mehta: With EVs, you talked about cost. With lower cost, adoption has increased in cities. There is no problem in walking in the city, but when you have to go from Delhi to Bombay, then people have this fear that about this range fear, right? That will I find a charging station on the way or not? So what are you doing about that?

Nitin Gadkari: See, that is not a problem. I used to come to this hotel. I don't take the name of the channel people. They used to ask me, you are talking about electric vehicle and if the car stops on the way, then will you come to push it? This question has been asked to me. Now no car has stopped. No one is pushing. I will give you one thing. Then they used to ask another question. How will you do charging in between? Now every vehicle has its charging from 250 to 400 kilometres. And now Bajaj and TVS have studied, so one scooter runs 24 to 26 kilometres in a day. And while they charged their scooter for 125 to 130 kilometres. The new startup came, 400 came, they kept a battery of 7 to 70 kilometres, reduced the cost and they are becoming popular in the market. So the first thing, charging domestic, there is no one in our city.

Now from the side of NHI, we are making 670 roadside amenities. We are making charging stations there. Many private people are opening their charging stations. Now the fast charging system has also come. And I am now starting a new bus, the first pilot project in Nagpur. It is a 135-seater bus and it has flash charging. It has Hitachi and Siemens technology. And Tata has also joined, two companies have also joined. Passengers will only need to show this card to board and alight the bus. The bus will be luxurious, with a TV and music system at every seat, and there will be a bus hostess, just like an air hostess, providing tea, water, and snacks. Additionally, compared to a diesel bus, the fare for this bus will be 30% lower. It’s because of the cost of the fuel.

The most important thing I tell you how it is going to change the map of India? Our logistics cost is 16%, while China's is 8%, and in America and European countries, it is 12%. I believe that we have built good highways, and in terms of fuel, electric, ethanol, methanol, bio-diesel, LNG, CNG, and hydrogen will soon become widely available in India. The vehicle I arrived in is the world's first car, the Innova, which runs 100% on bio-ethanol and generates 60% electricity. Its cost, compared to petrol, is only ₹25 per litre, making it highly cost-effective for the public. So now Tata, Mahindra, Suzuki, Hyundai and Toyota, five companies are now bringing their flex engines. Electric is also being developed. Now CNG, I have launched a two-wheeler motorcycle from Bajaj. So the cost of their petrol motorcycle per kilometre is Rs. 2.25 and CNG is Rs. 1.

Now in the whole of Punjab, Haryana, 200 lakh tonnes per litre of rice straw is made. This is the first year now, 60 lakh tonnes of rice straw has been converted into bio-CNG. And in two years, the entire conversion of rice straw will be in CNG or ethanol or bitumen, aviation fuel is also being made in Panipat, bio-aviation fuel. So I think pollution in Delhi will also be reduced. And because of all this alternative and bio-fuel, our economy will be very strong, export will increase.

Nalin Mehta: Sir, you talked about Delhi's pollution. Last one month, we've had a very bad state here. Today's AQI is still 331. So what can the government do and your ministry do to reduce that?

Nitin Gadkari: Look, this is happening in a natural process. Look, I myself have been making bio-CNG for the past three years. This tractor has just been launched by Mahindra. The pollution concern, 40% of the pollution in our country is air pollution. The transport ministry is responsible for that. Now we have electric buses, bio-CNG car, bio-CNG scooter, electric scooter, flex engine, ethanol as a fuel. The green India dream will definitely be fulfilled with all these initiatives. And I believe that solar power, in our total power basket, 40% is solar power. So in the coming time, the target of becoming carbon neutral by 2070 will be fulfilled. And I'm telling people one more thing, that hydrogen is the futuristic fuel. And it has the cheapest source. So if we do it in electrolyser and water, it takes 150 units of electricity. But the municipal waste is segregated and glass, metal and plastic are removed separately. So by putting organic waste in the biodigester, methane will be formed. And from methane, CNG will be formed. Already in our corporation, the hydrogen can also be formed. So the biggest source is biomass. By using biotechnology, increase the productivity of biomass. And by converting biomass and municipal waste into green hydrogen, we will become self-reliant. And we will be the exporter of energy, not the importer of the energy. This is what I believe.

Nalin Mehta: Sir, you talked about the project in Nagpur with the buses. Today, I think India produces about 50,000 EV buses in a year. You've talked about, in the past, about taking that to one lakh. Today, on this platform in Green Bharat Summit, in the morning a proposal was made that why can't the government mandate that all cars or buses bought by central government or state governments be EV buses, for example. What would you say to the proposal like that?

Nitin Gadkari: This is already ongoing under the scrapping policy. If they scrap their old vehicle, we are providing them money for a new vehicle. There is no need to explicitly state this. Everyone is buying. And let me tell you, our problem lies in manufacturing. We currently produce 50,000 buses, but there is an order for 1 lakh buses. Yesterday, I inaugurated the launch of Ashok Leyland's electric buses. They have received an order from Delhi. Currently, the country has the capacity to produce 50,000 to 55,000 buses, but the requirement is for 1.25 lakh buses. The Telangana minister came to me, saying, "Sir, please arrange buses for me from somewhere; no one in the market is able to supply them." The very first thing I want to say to everyone on the Green Bharat platform is that those involved in electric manufacturing should increase their capacity tenfold.

There is so much potential in the domestic and international markets because people are very much aware of the air pollution and they’re very cautious. And electric is very cheap fuel. And this will definitely happen, it's just about having the confidence. I remember once I told a company (I won’t mention their name) to go electric, and they said they would launch in 2024. (3:38:17 inaudible) Those who came first, their sale got increased while others' sales decreased. There is a very big giant in automobile manufacturing, and he is my friend. I told him to go electric. I met him the day before yesterday, and he said, "We didn’t take what you said seriously because we didn’t think the development would happen this fast. Now we’ve missed the bus.

Electric trucks are now entering the market, and they are incredibly cost-effective. If the price of lithium-ion batteries comes down to the level of petrol and diesel, just imagine the fuel savings—it's an economic game-changer. I recently attended an exhibition and inaugurated it yesterday. There, a company from Tamil Nadu showcased their electric trucks being used in mining. They said their capacity has now increased due to high demand.

In the coming times, India will undoubtedly be the fastest-growing economy. India is a country where infrastructure is given the highest priority. As for our department, there is no shortage of funds. I have built roads worth ₹5 lakh crore and have a plan to build roads worth ₹75 lakh crore in the future.

Nalin Mehta: Your budget for the year is ₹2.8 lakh crore, right?

Nitin Gadkari: With such efforts, the automobile industry and construction equipment sectors will undoubtedly benefit. Another important thing is "knowledge to wealth." This is a critical concept. I am very happy to see that our young, talented engineers and startups are doing an excellent job in innovation, entrepreneurship, science, technology, research, and skilled practices. We call this process of converting knowledge into wealth the future.

Now, regarding lithium-ion batteries, we have found the world's sixth-largest lithium deposit in Jammu. Alongside lithium-ion, new chemistries like zinc-ion, sodium-ion, and aluminum-ion batteries are emerging. Startups and scientists in India are working on this at a massive scale, and I am confident that we will become world leaders in this field. Our exports will grow, and I believe the entire world will gradually look up to India for electric solutions. This situation will certainly come true.

Nalin Mehta: In terms of next five years, the Prime Minister has talked about a vision of Viksit Bharat by 2047. There is a vision of a five trillion economy, of being the third largest economy. You talked about the auto sector. Auto sector is the biggest exporter now. You talked about the number of jobs that are there. So there will be a huge transformation, both in terms of the kind of cars, fuels, travel time from different cities. Five years from now, what is your vision for green mobility for this country, for Bharat over the next five years?

Nitin Gadkari: Look, currently, it takes 9 hours to travel from Delhi to Dehradun, but in 2-3 months, it will only take 2 hours. From Delhi to Jaipur, we are preparing routes, it will take two hours, and Delhi-Mumbai travel will take 12 hours. Delhi to Amritsar will take 4 hours, Delhi to Manali 7 hours, Delhi to Srinagar 8 hours, and Delhi to Katra 6 hours. From Chennai to Bangalore, the journey will take just 2 hours. Earlier, it took 4 hours from Meerut to Delhi; now, it’s just 50 minutes. This has already been achieved. Gradually, we are constructing 50 Green Expressways. For example, from Kashmir to Kanyakumari, Surat to Nashik, Nashik to Ahmednagar, Ahmednagar to Solapur, Solapur to Kurnool, and Kurnool to Chennai, Kanyakumari, Hyderabad, Bangalore, Mangalore, and Cochin—all of South India will be interconnected. This will eliminate the need to pass through Mumbai or Pune. The 320 km distance between Delhi and Chennai is being significantly reduced.

Right now, what you’re seeing in the road sector is just a trailer; the real film is yet to begin. Over the next two years, as these projects are completed, our road network will be equivalent to that of the USA. Let me tell you, the lower middle class will buy older vehicles, strap two bags on top, and take their entire family on trips. Currently, highways haven’t even been designed for daylong usage—what we’ve done is slightly improve the old roads—and yet, traffic in Uttarakhand has already tripled. They had to impose restrictions due to the overwhelming influx of tourists. Tourism is one of those sectors where 49% of capital expenditure directly creates employment opportunities. I called the chief minister and explained, “Build more restaurants, more hotels, and more parking spaces. If you close the state to tourism, what benefit will you get? Instead, capitalize on this.” So naturally, integrated development needs to happen alongside these projects.

And about your questions regarding targets like 30% or 40%—forget those! You won’t even realize how quickly this transformation will take place. It’s happening at an incredible speed.

Nalin Mehta: Sir, you said, we have just seen the news reel, the film is remaining. Who will be the stars of that film, sir? Which are the areas we are using maximum expansion?

Nitin Gadkari: Look, now the road has been completed. The work is going on. The public support is good. We went to the capital market in Mumbai. It was a 7-day time. So, on the first day, in 7 hours, we oversubscribed 7 times. In 7 hours, we closed the bond issue. So, we have no shortage of money. Our income is 52,000 crores per year. In the next 2 years, it will be 1,40,000 crores. If we keep on monitoring the road, there is no shortage of money. People are standing in line to give. So, first of all, there is no shortage of money. We will build roads. But now, I have decided that how can we build an electric highway? How can we make public transport comfortable on the highway? Now, we are building 360 ropeway, cable car, funicular railway. Then, we are building 670 roadside amenities. 2,000, we are building such small places on the road that there will be a petrol station, a restaurant, a dhaba. There will be parking for 20 cars and 5-6 trucks. There will be good toilets. We are building such small centres. And now, the 360 projects of ropeway and cable car have already come to us. Now, we are building a public transport hotel.

From Dhaula Kuan to Manesar, believe it or not, we have a study going on, a bus that runs in the air, which will drop 50-40 passengers in a minute. So, there are so many cars going from here to Gurgaon. It is tiring. I used to go to weddings. There is so much traffic jam at night. If millions of people go up, the traffic below will be less. So, to make public transport more comfortable and cost-effective, and to discourage people who take their cars out, if the comfort of public transport is increased, pollution will be reduced and people will get cheaper transport. This is a futuristic plan. And the bus stations, we are going to park them at the mall and make them look like airports. We have also planned to build a bus station. We have started the first multimodal hub in Katra. Multimodal means there is helicopter service, hotels, restaurants, offices, malls, everything. There is a railway station. And millions of people can go to the same place. So, we have a multimodal system in the country. There is a place called Jogidhopa in Assam. We have also built a multimodal hub near Brahmaputra. We are going to inaugurate it. We will concentrate on it because it will be an integrated development. It will be beneficial to all sectors.

Nalin Mehta: Sir, what are the biggest challenges you face in this expansion, particularly in land acquisition and others, across different states? What is your biggest challenge in this expansion?

Nitin Gadkari: Life itself is a challenge. I never get scared of challenges. If you do something good, it starts with worshipping bad star. There are some people who convert problems into opportunities. And there are some people who convert opportunities into problems. Problems are a part of life. Land acquisition, utility shift… In India, they don't ask people to build roads. They ask them to stop their work and stay. Sometimes foresters come, sometimes utility workers come, sometimes judiciary gives a stay. But you have to find a way out of that. This is the art of living. This is also the art of leadership. You need to understand how you are going to resolve the problem.

I remember when I was a young minister, Bal Thackeray gave me an acrylic sheet. I was building 55 flyovers, Worli, Bandra and Mumbai- Pune. There were a lot of problems. He wrote a slogan for me. I like people who can get things done. Let's go, there are problems. Solving them is a test of leadership.

Nalin Mehta: When you talked about Delhi and Dehradun's traffic, you had to talk to Uttarakhand Chief Minister about stopping it a little bit, in terms of controlling it. Between BJP and non-BJP states, when you deal with Chief Ministers, do you find a difference or is it similar for you?

Nitin Gadkari: There is a very beautiful spot. I saw it from a helicopter. Our road goes over the Ganges. There is a forest there, here is the Ganges, there is our road. So I thought of making it a tourist spot. And next to the road, there is a parking lot of 300-400 vehicles, and a small coffee shop. People will park their vehicles and see the Ganges, the forest, and the road. The forest department did not care about all this. If they didn't care, they didn't do it. I am very committed to the environment. That is why I talk about biofuel and alternative fuel. We transplanted 7.8 million trees. We planted 450 million trees. I have made an oxygen bird park in Nagpur. I have made a beautiful pond with fruit trees in a big area.

And I have planted only fruits, no humans will pluck these fruits, only birds will eat. I am very committed to ecology. But this area-centric approach is not right. We need development and we need to project the ecology and environment. In Delhi, I have put 80 lakh tons of garbage on the road. The environment will not be saved. CNG is being prepared from Parali. 60 lakh tons of Parali is being used. If it burns, pollution will increase. In two years, if 200 lakh tons of Parali is converted waste to wealth, the country will change, imports will be saved, costs will be saved, and pollution in Delhi will decrease. Instead of keeping one side eccentric, we should work with positivity to protect the ecology and environment.

Nalin Mehta: There's a lot of work happening where waste is being used to construct roads and for recycling as part of the "Green Bharat" initiative. Do you see a large percentage of roads being made from recycled materials in the next 4-5 years?

Nitin Gadkari: Till now, we have used 20 lakh tons of waste on the Dolaro-Amdabad road. You can go to the airport in half an hour from Panipat. We have also made a tunnel under the airport. We will inaugurate it in two or three months. We have put garbage in it. We have built a crash barrier of 80 kilometres of bamboo. We will use rubber tyre and plastic. The powder of the rubber tyre is 15 percent and the plastic is 7 percent. We will use bitumen. When CNG is prepared from rice straw, the central research organization has experimented. I have to go to see that road next week. In that, 35 percent of the lignin waste comes out after preparing CNG from Parali. We will put that in bitumen.

In our country, 80 lakh tons of bitumen are used. 40 to 45 lakh tons are given by the Indian refinery and 45 to 50 lakh tons are imported. If this waste plastic, waste rubber, and this lignin goes to the dam, we will easily save 25 lakh tons. That much import will be saved and that much waste will be converted to wealth. There are many things that can be done to protect the ecology and environment. Diesel is being made from plastic. Industrial diesel type. People can now put it in tractors and trucks. These are very good, successful experiments. And by doing this slowly, to save money is to earn money. Similarly, using waste material and reducing pollution. I say, create value in waste.

I remember when I was a minister in Maharashtra, Sheila Dixit was the urban minister. I used to come for flash. I used to come many times for flash. Now the situation of flash is such that flash is not available. There is a shortage of flash. There are fights for flash. There is political pressure for flash. Why? Because it was used for flash. I am writing to you, after the next 5 years, there will be a fight for waste. People will fight, this waste is mine, this waste is mine. It is not a matter of storing. Because when technology is used to add value, things will definitely change.

Nalin Mehta: The Prime Minister has often talked about river transport as part of Green Bharat and about improving our transportation across that. Earlier, there was a lot in India, but now there is very little. Your Bharat Mala project includes connecting different economic corridors, highways to state highways, but also to ports and to coastal ways. What is the progress there?

Nitin Gadkari: We are doing a project of 108 port connectivity. It is worth Rs. 1,30,000 crores. We have started working on many projects. And by connecting these ports, there are major ports, smaller medium ports, and we are connecting all of them. Secondly, when I was the minister of shipping and waterways, I put a bill in the parliament and converted 108 rivers for water transport. Now, from Varanasi to Haldia, we have made 1,380 waterways. Then from there, from the port of Bengal to Brahmaputra, we did grazing. At that time, Sushmaji was the minister and the Prime Minister of Bangladesh told him that there is a Mungli port in Bangladesh. So, I went 175 kilometres and made waterways in Bangladesh as well as in Brahmaputra. Now, we have made waterways in Ganga and Brahmaputra. A lot has been done.

In Mumbai, in BPT, we started a row-row-row-pack service with 30-40 services. We put our cars and buses inside the ship and sit in the restaurant on the fifth or sixth floor. Now, from JNPT to Alibag —no, BPT to Alibag it takes three hours from the road. Now, this goes in 20 minutes and people get off immediately and leave in their cars. So, on a large scale, the work of water transport has started. There is a need to do more.

Secondly, you may remember that in the sea of Mumbai, I got off from an airplane, an MPBS seaplane. I told the aviation people to make a new law or else I will make a new law in the name of a flying boat. Because there are both, a flying boat and an airplane. So, I got off in the sea and Modi ji took me from Sabarmati to Sardar Sarovar. So, MPBS seaplane can also be used. Secondly, our boats have different technologies and rivers. So, cruises run in Brahmaputra. Now, Varanasi to Haldia requires an investor. So, for this, something has started in Varanasi.

Now, I spoke to Yogi ji and I told him that in technology, I will tell Cochin shipyard that we will make a world standard cruise. See how unfortunate you are. People from India go to Singapore and in Singapore, they travel the world. People from India go to Dubai and travel the world on a cruise. And how many people are there? 7 lakh people. They pay in dollars. Our sea goes there. So, in Cochin, Mumbai, I made a very big cruise port. I started Goa from Mumbai. Now, we can make cruise tourism popular. And Dubai and Singapore can start from here. So, the specialty of water transport is that for example, to go to the railway, it costs 10 rupees, sorry, to go to the road, it costs 10 rupees, to go to the railway, it costs 6 rupees and to go to the water, it costs 1 rupee. So, the first priority is waterways. The second priority is railway. The third priority is road. And the fourth priority is aviation.

In the near future, we will develop in our country. So it has potential. If you look at Europe, in almost every country, the major cities are located near rivers. They utilize river ports to transport containers directly to seaports. This is the same in America and Europe, where logistics costs are much lower. For instance, if a container leaves Ludhiana in Punjab, it currently requires diesel-guzzling trucks to transport it. However, with the new highways we've built, transit times have been halved. Previously, these trucks had to pass through the centre of Delhi. When I first came to Delhi, there were so many trucks passing through areas like Dhaula Kuan at night. There was constant pollution and traffic jams. We addressed this by building ring roads, which have greatly reduced congestion and pollution in those areas. We need to adopt new technologies and innovations to reduce transport costs. We must fully utilize natural resources and advancements to make logistics more efficient.

Nalin Mehta: Regarding logistics costs, you mentioned that they could reduce to about 9% in two or three years.

Nitin Gadkari: Let me assure you—unlike other politicians whose statements are often doubted—whatever I say is 100% accurate. Within nine years, India's logistics cost, which is currently 14-16%, will come down to single digits at around 9%. This will happen as road infrastructure improves and alternative fuels are adopted.

Nalin Mehta: We will have you again here on this platform.

Nitin Gadkari: Hundred precent.

Nalin Mehta: Coming back to electric vehicles (EVs), you recently stated your personal view that it’s time to phase out subsidies. Currently, the GST on EVs is 5%, compared to 48% for other vehicles. What is your perspective?

Nitin Gadkari: Look, people often get upset with this topic, but I believe electric vehicles no longer need subsidies. Subsidies were essential when battery costs were $150 per kilowatt-hour, but now they’ve dropped to $80 per kilowatt-hour, and it’s a numbers game. I always say, in India, people are highly attracted to anything that comes for free. However, we should stop focusing on subsidies now and instead work on scaling up production, reducing costs, and ensuring profitability.

For products like electric tractors, subsidies might still be needed to promote adoption. Similarly, subsidies could help for heavy industrial machinery. However, electric scooters, cars, and buses have already become popular, and there’s no need for subsidies in these areas anymore. Demand is already outpacing supply—there’s a waiting list for vehicles, and even buses aren’t being delivered on time. For example, while the market needs one lakh buses, manufacturers can only produce 50,000.

As the production numbers increase, costs will naturally come down. For products yet to be launched in the electric vehicle sector, subsidies may be justified for a limited time, but this is my personal opinion. There is another ministry who oversees subsidies, and if they choose to continue them, it’s their decision.

Nalin Mehta: Finally, with the budget coming up in 2-3 months, we are seeing signs of a slowdown in certain areas. How important do you see is the role of the government and private sector to increase growth again including capex growth?

Nitin Gadkari: Look, let me first say that development work based on the government budget is just one part of the equation. Our government has strongly encouraged public-private investment, and I have been a proponent of the BOT model. Let me give you an example to illustrate. In Mathura, there was 80 MLD (million litres per day) of sludge, and while I was the Water Resources Minister, I introduced a project under the hybrid annuity model. In this model, the government provides 40% of the funding, and 60% comes from private investors. Mathura has an Indian Oil refinery, so I approached Mr. Vaidya, the chairman, and asked, “Where do you source your water from?” He replied, “The Uttar Pradesh Irrigation Department.” I asked, “How much do you pay?” He said, “25 crores.” I told him, “I’ll save you 5 crores. You give us 20 crores instead.”

We put the project out to tender, and Trivani engineering company specializing in refineries took it up. What was initially a 100-crore project was completed with 40% less cost. This way, Mathura's 80 MLD sludge was managed. Even with waste, public-private investment is possible—for example, creating CNG or green hydrogen from waste. Municipal corporations can undertake such projects using public-private partnerships.

In my constituency, for the past eight years, we’ve been selling wastewater from toilets to the Maharashtra government for the Koradi and Khaparkheda power projects. You won’t believe this, but we generate 300 crores annually for the corporation by selling this wastewater. We can treat such water and provide it to industries. When public-private investment combines with government budgets, the scale of capital investment will increase, employment opportunities will grow, per capita income will rise, more jobs will be created, growth will accelerate, and GDP will improve.

For example, we are privatizing bus ports under the BOT model. Roads, cable cars, and similar infrastructure can also be developed through private corporations. Moving forward, the government should focus on projects with low internal rates of return (IRR), while high-IRR projects should be transparently tendered out for high-quality work and long-term maintenance.

We now require contractors to maintain projects for 10 years as part of defect liability. If anything goes wrong, we immediately enforce penalties—cash their bank guarantee, blacklist them, or disqualify them from future tenders. This way, we don’t need to use excessive government manpower, and the work remains of high quality.

When the strengths of both government and private sectors come together, GDP growth will accelerate, and we will move closer to becoming Atmanirbhar Bharat (self-reliant India). The economy will strengthen, and I believe this will also attract foreign investment. There are immense opportunities across sectors. For instance, in aviation, the growth rate is currently 24%, and it is poised to expand significantly in the future. When the Delhi airport was built, people thought it was so large. But now even that has become congested. Over the next 10 years, we’ll need three more airports like it. There is immense potential here, and India is currently the fastest-growing economy in the world. I believe that today, the world is keen to deal with India, even though there are certain countries I won’t name that some nations prefer to avoid dealing with. This presents a massive opportunity for us.

As far as electric vehicles (EVs) are concerned, there’s absolutely no need to worry. The sector will grow as much as we allow it to, and I can confidently and positively say that the sky is the limit. There’s no reason for concern. For example, the semiconductor shortage was an issue, but now companies like Tata, Hitachi, Suzuki, Adani, and Panasonic are stepping into this space. They’re working on electric batteries, and in the coming years, India will become very strong in this field.

Nalin Mehta: Say in terms of for EV manufacturing there, for example, in mobile phones, earlier we used to import, not we are exporting. Semiconductors, you’ve talked about. What lessons can we draw from that for the EV ecosystem for a private sector?

Nitin Gadkari: There’s one thing to note, though: the industry must be extremely cautious about quality. You may remember when 27–28 EVs caught fire, and then certain lobbies started speaking out against electric vehicles. Media outlets picked up the story, and it created a lot of noise. We called upon scientists from ISRO, technical experts, and IIT professionals to investigate the issue. They found that the imported cells being used did not meet proper standards. Once we established strict standards for EVs, there hasn’t been a single incident of fire since. This proves the importance of focusing on quality. Let me tell you, honesty, quality, and credibility are the biggest capitals of the 21st century. Don’t take shortcuts—shortcuts will cut you short. If you work with honesty, credibility, and quality, the global market will undoubtedly come to us.

However, if you use substandard, duplicate materials, the entire product will be discredited, and that will create significant challenges. So, avoid such practices.

Nalin Mehta: With Trump soon coming to power in the US and entering the White House, what opportunities do you see for the industry and for green initiatives in India, especially in terms of the overall industrial sector?

Nitin Gadkari: Sir, the greatest potential lies in green hydrogen. The fuel of the future is hydrogen. Trains will run on it, airplanes will run on it, industries will operate with it, and there will be no need for petrol, diesel, or coal. I believe that India is now working on a large scale in this area. Hydrogen-powered buses have already arrived. I even have a hydrogen-powered car called Mirai—a Japanese word meaning "future." Unfortunately, I didn’t bring it with me today, but it symbolizes the vision of the future.

The futuristic vision for development is green hydrogen, and it is crucial. There are four sources of hydrogen: black hydrogen is produced from coal, brown hydrogen from petroleum, and green hydrogen is produced from water and waste. This makes green hydrogen the most sustainable and forward-thinking solution. In the electrolyser process, 150 units of power are required, which makes hydrogen cost ₹300 per kilogram. While I can’t commit to it yet, my aspiration is to bring the cost of hydrogen down to $1 per kilogram. For this, if we can get municipal waste free of charge and produce methane from it to create hydrogen, it would be a game-changer. The biggest challenge is the transport of hydrogen and the establishment of filling stations. I believe people will also start focusing on this aspect, and hydrogen is undoubtedly the fuel of the future. We will not only use it domestically but also export it. Hydrogen will be used across sectors, from railways to airplanes.

I believe this is a sector where India can transform its energy landscape. Today, we are an energy-importing country, spending ₹22 lakh crore on energy imports. By exporting hydrogen, we can bring that ₹22 lakh crore into the country. Just imagine the massive socio-economic impact this could have on India.