The Goat Life author Benyamin: Jesus turning water into wine 'was a social transformation event'

In email interviews, Benyamin and Ministhy S. spoke about their inspiration and approach to writing and translating this book, respectively; the Israel-Palestine conflict; Benyamin's biggest literary influences; why Benyamin thinks 'The Second Book of Prophets' is unlike anything he has written before; and how Ministhy S. only translates books that speak to her as a reader. Edited excerpts:

BENYAMIN

You have said in the past that you draw on your experiences to write your stories and novels. Is that also the case with this book?

I cannot say that this is entirely the case with this book. Because it is a book written based on the Bible. It depicts a very old era. What influenced me here was my reading. As someone who comes from a Christian family, the Bible has always fascinated me. Therefore, I have tried to read it separately from faith. That is when I was able to find many interpretations of the modern era. Especially after the discovery of the Qumran Dead Sea Scrolls and the Nag Hammadi Scrolls. That reading took me back to the Bible and made me read the time of Christ in a new way. At the same time, one thing that I mainly noticed was the human nature of trying to protect the interests of one's own class, which is at odds with each other, even when fighting a common enemy. We have seen it even in our freedom struggle. This novel tries to tell the issue based on the life of Jesus.

What precipitated the writing of 'The Second Book of Prophets'? In your author's note in the book, you've talked about the discoveries of the Dead Sea Scrolls at Qumran in the West Bank and Nag Hammadi Library allowing for "myriad retellings...for that period of history and the life of Jesus Christ". Later in the book, you also write about how the Jews lost "their fight...due to internecine conflicts and treachery...not merely suppression by the enemy... Throughout history, the story of failed revolts and battles follows the same narrative." Did you have any particular failed revolts or infighting in mind, while writing the book?

The readings of these documents (Dead Sea Scrolls and Nag Hammadi Library) and their interpretations led me to the novel. Although many have interpreted the Bible and the life of Christ in different ways, I realized that there was potential for a new novel in the context of this new information.

We can find this internal conflict in every failed struggle and every revolutionary attempt. One of the most recent examples is the Jasmine Revolution in the Arab countries. In many countries, the revolution against authoritarian regimes reached a point where it turned into conflicts between sects. Even in countries where regimes were overthrown, we can see that there was later conflict over who would rule and that led to internal unrest.

Did the ongoing Israel-Gaza conflict come into your thoughts around why and how you wanted to write this book?

Indeed. The Israeli-Palestinian conflict is a great historical lesson for us. The PLO (Palestine Liberation Organization), led by Yasser Arafat, is about to bring it to a peaceful end when Hamas jumps in and disrupts everything. Every Palestinian wants an independent state free from Israeli domination. But they are scattered into more than 20 parties with different opinions. Then how can they resist a great power like Israel? The novel tries to say that this problem has existed since ancient times.

The story itself is well known. It is also the subject of many parables and plays around the world. Were you also thinking about these texts and formats while writing the book?

Yes, these are stories that everyone knows. But this work updates the stories that everyone knows with interpretations that everyone does not know. For example, the incident where Jesus turned water into wine. We read it as a miracle. But it was a social transformation event. At that time, wine was not served to everyone at a wedding feast. It was only reserved for the elite of society. Jesus intervenes and subverts that law and serves it to the poor as well. That is how it becomes miraculous. In this way, a new face is given to each event and each character in the Bible. Thus, this will become a new novel.

You've said in a previous interview that you don't write the story in a linear fashion, from beginning to end. Tell us which section of 'The Second Book' did you end up writing first, and which section did you spend the most time writing, revising and rewriting?

My writing is not linear at all, and I don't know where each part will go. I put it in order at the end of the writing process. This is possible because I have a clear understanding of the novel. I remember that the first thing I wrote were the interpretations of Jesus' miracles in this novel. What took the most time and was rewritten was to provide logical explanations for the events that took place on the night of Passover. Because, I needed a historical explanation for why the people who had sung Hosanna to Jesus shouted to crucify him just after three days.

Entire passages in this book feel quite contemporary. Like Jesus's inner struggle to figure out what kind of leader he wants to be, as he ponders: "If the people didn't want it, what then? What is my role amongst them? My value? What is their feeling towards me?" How did you balance what is an old and well-known story with contemporary concerns in this book?

What we are writing may be an old story. But if it cannot resonate with the latest times and new minds, I feel that it cannot have any literary value. Therefore, this novel discusses how the mind of society works, how leaders should be. How power divides people, love, disappointment, its hatred, loneliness and isolation. Although it is old in terms of subject matter, I believe that it is the latest in terms of mind.

You've written about spirituality and faith before, in Body and Blood, among other books. And yet 'The Second Book of Prophets' feels different from your earlier writings. Did it feel different to you as a writer, too?

This novel is different from all my other novels. Other works depict the most recent times, the most recent life, the crises it faces, and the urgency. It features people, events, and landscapes that are familiar to me. But in this one, the time, the landscapes, and the people were not close to me. Therefore, I started writing this work by reading, researching, and studying very carefully. Even though it is a story, I insist that there should be no historical errors. Even when stories are lies, they must have a credible basis. Only then will readers believe those lies. For that, I have conducted in-depth research for this book.

You've talked about the availability of world literature in Malayalam in the past. Who do you count among your greatest literary influences? Also, are you reading anything now?

Born and raised in an ordinary Christian family with no tradition of literature or reading, I was made a literature lover by the world's best writers. I come to writing after seeing the wonders their writings bring to the world. Even today, I can only write after reading. I am so addicted to reading. Among them, I have a lot of affection for Kazant Zakis, Romain Rolland, Kafka, Marquez, Jose Saramago, Orhan Pamuk, and Elif Shafak. One of the best novels I have read recently is Abraham Varghese's 'Covenant of Water'. Another is Gorgi Gospodinov's 'Time Shelter'. The book I am currently reading is Safiya Sinclair's autobiography 'How to say Babylon'.

MINISTHY S

You've translated works by some very experimental contemporary Malayalam writers, from VJ James to Benyamin. Tell us about your process when you take up a work for translation. Is it different for different writers?

I have worked with many different writers in my mother tongue. The books are in various stages of publication. The topics have been varied, from Indian philosophy, time and death, stock markets, Holy Bible, Arabian women, stock markets and grave diggers, amongst others.

I do not translate a book which does not appeal to me as a reader. I have to feel the pull within to translate it. Till now, either the author has connected with me and requested a translation, or I have reached out after reading a book, expressing my interest in taking it forward in English. I have had instances of good friends recommending books for translation too.

What was your first impression of 'The Second Book of Prophets' when you read it in Malayalam? And did you read it multiple times before or during translation?

I loved the book and was intrigued by the bold retelling of Jesus’ life as a revolutionary leader. Every conventional belief has been upended so intelligently and logically. More than anything, the great visionary leader’s compassion and humanity was shining through in the text.

As a translator, you read a book multiple times. Sometimes, more intimately than the writer himself.

As "a secular narration of the life and times of Jesus Christ", did this book pose any special challenges for you as a translator? Especially since the text is drawn from religion, and the world today can be quick to take offence on religious subjects?

I did a lot of reading of my own to understand Benyamin’s nuanced and iconoclastic retelling of Christ’s life. Khalil Gibran’s classic work, ‘Jesus, the Son of Man’, was one of the references I found helpful. I remember re-reading Anatole France’s story ‘The Procurator of Judea.’

You will notice that the Old Testament, ancient Jewish politics, Roman rulers, political conspiracies and numerous revolutions have been keenly explored in the book. Understanding those details needed a lot of research and study.

Well, the life of Christ shows us that when you walk a different path, sufferings are inevitable. But Jesus was never afraid, was he? Nothing creative comes from fear. By the way, Malayalam literature and movies have been forerunners of courageous storytelling, as long as I can remember.

Tell us about a section that you loved translating in 'The Second Book of Prophets', and why you loved it.

The chapter ‘Oaths’ where the whole Jewish history is narrated by the fiery members of the Tribe of Benjamin was very interesting. The amount of intellectual stimulation it provided was priceless. I did tonnes of reading and kept troubling Benyamin with my doubts!

Tell us about a section you struggled with/mulled longer than others, and why.

The chapter ‘Revelations’, where Jesus undergoes intense solitude in the desert was the toughest. It is a series of inner monologues and reflections. Now, whose thoughts were going through my mind? That was something terrifying to realize. But I am a great believer in the Lord in all His myriad forms. I just prayed that I passed the test, you see.

Tell us about the English title of the work — did it come from you or Benyamin or the publisher? Did you have any other titles in mind?

'The Second Book of Prophets' happens to be the literal translation of Benyamin’s original Malayalam title:  'Pravachakanmarude Randam Pustakam'. I think it is wonderful that both the Malayalam and English titles are printed in the book.

There are some memorable, pithy lines in the book. An example that comes to mind is when Didymos thinks "In times of crisis, we must undertake daring experiments with life", and this gives him the push he needs to climb a mountain after dark. Tell us about your inspiration here — did some of it come from the way the Bible reads?

Most of the world’s books on the power of positive thinking have basis on the scriptures. Every religious book, if you study and reflect for yourself, shows the way to live a beautiful life aligned with a purpose: something much bigger than one’s own little self.  So yes, my inspiration, while I was translating Benyamin’s words, was the same life-giving energy.

In your note in the book, you've talked about translating James's 'The Book of Exodus' before taking up 'The Second Book of Prophets'. Did this coincidence help or matter in any significant way?

In 2024, there were two translations that were published: V.J. James’ ‘The Book of Exodus’ (Penguin Random House) and Sheela Tomy’s ‘Do Not Ask the River Her Name.’ (HarperCollins). Both involved deep reading of the Holy Bible. Without those books, this one would not have materialized. As I mentioned earlier, serendipity has been a gracious presence all through my translation journey.

In 'The Second Book...', people are always going somewhere; resolving to do something; eating, drinking, discussing; looking for someone; planning... Even Jesus is often thinking and rethinking his role, his place; his internal monologue often comprising multiple questions. Tell us how you navigated the pace of this text. 

There is this usage : “Show not Tell”.  Benyamin is a writer who prefers to ‘show’ and hence the thriller like pace of the script. Translation is an art which is faithful to the original script. The creative flourishes or experimentation is conducted within the framework of the original. I enjoyed the author’s style and tried to replicate it in translation.