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(Interview Transcript)
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Inflation for week-ended April 26 is at 7.61% versus 7.57%. The market had estimated it at 7.60%. A poll conducted by CNBC-TV18 had estimated it at 7.6%.
Gaurav Kapur, Senior Economist, ABN AMRO Bank feels that there would be some respite for now. All the action that has been taken by the government is likely to show some result and it is really showing some kind of effect in the momentum, he told CNBC-TV18.
However, Mridul Sagar, Chief Economist, Kotak Securities is not too sure about how inflation would pan out from here. "One, the way we look at base effect is fine; I mean some relief may come from there. But the alleviated prices last year would also mean that probably you will continue to have inflation through the year," he said.
Both Kapur and Sagar see inflation touching 8% this year.
RVS Sridhar, Senior VP-Treasury, Axis Bank does not expect to see much of a reaction from the bond market side based on the inflation numbers right now.
Excerpts from CNBC-TV18’s exclusive interview with Gaurav Kapur, Mridul Sagar and RVS Sridhar:
Q: Inflation at 7.61%, would you say that the worst is over at least for the next one month or so?
Kapur: I think so. I think at least for the next two weeks certainly with a favourable base effect of almost 40 basis points, it seems that the momentum that we have seen in prices is perhaps behind us for the momentum. So, things are stabilising. But that is a short-term respite because globally particularly oil prices are moving up and come June-September quarter, we typically see prices going up than any other quarter in the case of India during the fiscal year.
So, I think for the moment, there is some respite. All the action that has been taken by the government is likely to show some result and I think it is really showing some kind of effect in the momentum.
Q: What are you are expecting in terms of the play out in May? Do you think we have sent the worst for now and we can look forward to a sub-7% very soon?
Sagar: Well I do hope this turns out to be correct, but I am not too sure about how inflation would pan out from here. One, the way we look at base effect is fine; I mean some relief may come from there. But the alleviated prices last year would also mean that probably you will continue to have inflation through the year.
Also, the fact remains that adjustment of prices has not really taken place completely. There is a lot of pass through that is still to occur in the Indian economy. Now it is up to administrative policies on how this pass through is going to take place.
Global commodity prices have shot up like anything since 2004 and particularly last year. The pass through is lagging behind considerably for most of the commodities not just oil, but even fertilisers for instance.
Q: When international crude prices are at USD 125/bbl, a lot of manufactured items will reflect that in the months to come. The pass-through may not happen in terms of domestic fuel prices and maybe to some extent limited in terms of domestic steel prices as well, but every important machinery and commodity is going to reflect that fuel price as well. How would you see inflation say two months down the line? I am harping on that because the RBI Governor as well as the government are banking on inflation moderating in 2-3 months. Do you think that can be realised given the way commodity prices have gone over the past two weeks?
Kapur: I think there are clearly two things. The government and the RBI have taken some fairly strong and severe steps particularly the government in trying to bring down inflation.
But as I was saying earlier, June-September is a period where I would think things could actually worsen from hereon before they improve. So, I would not be too optimistic on inflation coming down sharply especially considering the way oil prices are moving. As you pointed out, besides petrol and diesel prices that are largely government determined, there are other fuels that are linked to the price of crude oil. There are a number of other commodities that are linked to the price of crude oil, fertilisers for instances whose prices are linked to crude oil.
Similarly, I think as Dr. Sagar pointed out, the pass through is yet to be seen. I think in a number of commodities where the raw material cost for instance, steel costs have gone up. So, you have seen a hike in car prices. Similarly, I think the second round impact of the initial increase in raw material prices is yet to be seen.
Q: Nobody has been expecting a sharp fall in inflation like you have been saying. But do you think that the RBIs expectation of a general moderation will be realised? Very briefly put, in or before July, do you think they will have to take any rate or CRR action?
Kapur: I would not rule out a CRR action before July. I think inflation will not come to the comfort levels - we are looking to, certainly not by July or perhaps even a little later. So, I would not be surprised if they go ahead with a CRR hike.
Q: But you are not expecting rate action?
Kapur: Well, considering the RBIs preference for CRR at the moment, yes. But one can always be surprised. I was expecting a rate hike in April. But it has not happened. So, I would not rule that out either. But considering that RBI is preferring CRR at this point, I would think if anything that will be the first step of action.
Q: In the next two-three months ,what kind of inflation are you extrapolating - are you seeing 8% anytime in June and therefore what is your guess of RBI action in July or before July?
Sagar: RBI has already taken measures and as the situation evolves, it could take more measures as well. The important point to remember is that we have seen excess money supply, excess liquidity in the money markets in the daily lakh balances of over USD 500 billion in this financial year so far and that has stayed inspite of the CRR hike. So one could imagine if Reserve Bank would not have hiked CRR, then what the impact would have been. So Reserve Bank of India is doing what it can do and the government has also taken measures. What is important to understand is that this inflation is a global phenomena - India cannot remain isolated from the high inflation; you see inflation is running at more than 4% in US - in the UK it is just moderated to just under 4% in euro zone, which is an inflation hawk and targets 2%; inflation is still running at 3.5%.
Q: Your short point is that you don’t rule out rate action in July despite this good number?
Sagar: I do agree with Gaurav Kapur that the reference could be on managing liquidity giving the rate hike signal.
Q: What kind of a spin does that put on things?
Kapur: I think it is clearly showing that the numbers, which we see right now are certainly much higher than one is seeing at the moment. This is something, which we have seen for throughout 2008 on average. To my mind, the upward revisions have been over 50-basis points. So inflation at this point in time itself is perhaps over 8%. So considering all that, we are not out of the woods so to say in terms of inflation.
Q: Your conviction of a rate action before July is increasing?
Kapur: I would say yes, some action perhaps before July. I would not rule that out.
Q: How would bond prices react from hereon they have- I guess given up some of their gains is that after the March 1 inflation numbers?
Sridhar: March 1 - they have been have been slightly volatile because there we have had an auction for Rs 10,000 crore. The fact remains that the inflation numbers are not too much off the expectations of people for this week. We don’t expect to see much of a reaction from the bond market side based on the inflation numbers that we are seeing.
Q: Give us your guess of what kind of inflation high you would see from now to say the next quarter- I am sticking to July because that is the next credit policy review?
Kapur: I would think on a higher side it can very well touch eight quarter. In the vicinity of eight quarter, not on a higher side- I mean between 8-8.5 in the next quarter.
Sagar: Yes. I do see inflation touching 8% this year.
Q: In the next quarter are you expecting that kind of a number?
Sagar: Yes, towards the June end it could be the number.
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